Susan: tough times don't last but tough people do um I put all my time efforts into it first tool stof fail with AI because uh is it definitely saves your time when you're creating po or when you're generating whether you're generating images but the only thing is welcome to

Alva Chew: where are my customers brought to you by aroch and produced by stric hey Susan welcome to the where are my customers podcast where we bring agency and business owners on to the show to share their business Journey the ups and downs the struggles and wins as we learn more about where and how to our customers and keep them so student thanks for making time and being here with us hi thanks Ela for inviting to the podcast I appreciate that yeah and you know I also want to take this opportunity to catch up with you because I think it's been a couple of months since we last catch up was that right yeah it was while you were building aroch check yeah that was a while back okay but so um before we get into it right for the benefit of audience and those new to you can you uh give an introduction of yourself and what you do right uh so I am the founder of half

Susan: Solutions uh so we we are web design marketing company uh we recently got awarded like top web design and marketing company Awards as well uh basically uh the main focus that we are doing is interactive storytelling websites uh to stand out from the crow yeah that's fantastic and I remember

Alva Chew: when I first got to know you right I think you reach out to me on LinkedIn and and we connected and that point in time I don't know if I mentioned you I probably would have I was very impressed at the fact that you are so young and you know you were having a full-time job but you also doing you know this on the side and you're you know the at the pace at that you're growing I was very amazed and you know I heard you share about all these things so uh just to ref fresh again how long has it been was it uh for one or two years that you have actually started this agency uh yes uh when I met you I was still a freelancer uh so I was working alone uh even now uh I I still do everything myself but of course with the support of some team members uh so yeah uh it's it's it's a team now okay that's fantastic and again you know that is testment to how much you have grown since then when I first saw you right but the interesting thing is what I later found out and I'm hoping that you can share it more right is you previously ran an e-commerce stock am I right yes that was before you you know Transit into uh freelancing digital marketing services and then in know into an agency so can you share a bit more about that part of the journey where you were a e-commerce uh Merchant all right sure so uh it was back in 20119 I was uh still in college uh so I I had to find ways to uh do uh

Susan: get some cash in uh so I I was trying to be uh trying to sell online so first I I was selling on Facebook and then I started to know about Shopify and it was very amazing you know all these Shopify screenshots like how how much you make in a day it was very enticing to see this so uh also I wanted to try out uh so first uh first two of my stores they fail so I did try uh actually what I was doing was Drop Shipping uh so very openly I don't see uh I don't see myself uh going very big uh like you know um having a factory or rather you know even if I get a lot of sales um main reason is because it was basically Drop Shipping you get you have to understand about legal and also uh packaging is another thing branding is another thing you can do it right but then I it's a beauty brand so basically I was for what you know what people put on the face is quite sensitive as well so uh so I have to tr I sold it over mainly because I okay at this point I want to stop I want to focus on other things so that's where I U built the store but uh then after that I was focusing on uh branding social media it was very fun that time uh doing all this stuff uh it was like um I put all my time efforts into it uh um and it it went well first two store fail but the Final store it it actually make quite good sales and many two referrals that's interesting and I think it kind of also

Alva Chew: speaks about you know the car of character you have and the resilience because um I know a lot of people uh and probably including myself you know sometimes when we do site projects we you know uh like yourself we we do some uh Ecommerce store we we try to you know get some drop shiing product and then you know and obviously didn't work out and you know we're just like okay screw it doesn't work and then we we just you drop it one side and move on to something else right but you mentioned that you add fit twice before you f success in the while so again I very fascinated by that uh psychology you know that that that my friendship can maybe walk us through like how you felt when the first two fail when how the like when the first one failed you know what was that mindset and how do you decide okay you want to try again what what was that consideration and also when the second one feel right like some people would have said oh you know maybe it's not for me and but yet you persisted so walk us through that thinking process that you had all right um okay so when the first one failed uh I actually uh well I didn't feel

Susan: anything because I still have I was doing parttime jobs as well so I had my it was not like you know I had some backup plans it was not like okay this Shopify store must get a lot of sales to make a living it was not like that so that's why I I think uh people have to start early so when they have something back up or to something to back back out right so uh okay first St fa I didn't feel anything second St fail um it was a little bit uh uh tough uh because okay I was running as I was doing I was trying to correct whatever mistakes I made in my first St but uh then I later on I found out that uh branding and the message that I want to give to the audience was not there it was I was just trying to sell but I did not have enough uh enough message for the audience to audience cannot relate to what I was trying to deliver to them so it was it was just all about selling you know pop PS uh all the email marketing but then uh it it won't be I won't be able to testing in the long run without getting a certain amount of sales every day or weekly so that's why I change everything uh including branding I uh I even uh order like custom packaging uh that's cater to my brand only uh so yeah uh that that's how I felt and how I changed the whole way of uh selling so from between your second store and your third store that eventually got successful

Alva Chew: right was it the same product that you continue is just that you change the branding or you you totally changed the product as well uh second store had uh quite ay of products and so like it was very way too Diversified so I was trying toh sell everything people I think they

Susan: call that generals General store and then uh but then I prefer uh selling onl very Niche uh product so uh I I cut down some of the products but but basically it was almost the same just The Branding change the message change the websites change yeah although I mean right

Alva Chew: there is probably some uh wisdom and and teach to take away right because uh essentially it wasn't a total change of product but because you actually rebranded right and you repackage and you focus more on The Branding and the messaging and you know that was then eventually you found success am I right to say that yes yes okay and so in that Journey right when you were trying uh to Market and and get more sales as e-commerce Merchant uh were there certain advice that you do were there certain channels that you look up look towards or successful you know because you mentioned just oh you were looking at all this you know videos of you know screenshots of fantastic sales and things like what were there certain channels that you were following and were were there certain advice that you follow that work in your favor or were there certain channels where you follow and you realize they're all BS that doesn't work it's total fantasy yeah um yes there are two channels that I follow I mean there are LW that I watch but there are only two channels that walked uh one is I think uh a Scot house

Susan: I think it's the I pronoun correctly so this guy is a very famous drop shipper and almost every drop shipper knows him so this is the Scot is one and there's another guy I forgot his name but he is very genuine he's I watch all the tutorials that they publish and you could get it for free online so I just look out for free downloads and then I look through all the tutorial I look through all the tutorial multiple times so until I remember it um uh even without even like so the next episode what would it be about so uh it was it was mainly on really understanding and understanding how the whole thing works and how you are going to implement it later on right I see and it's interesting because there are so many people that we also know of where you know they sign up for certain causes expensive programs and you know they

Alva Chew: don't get the success right and you were saying that actually the two that you follow they actually have a lot of resources freely available so you technically could be successful without even paying you know ex uh Healy school fees or cost right yeah okay that's fantastic um but after that you mention you so and then you start doing the um digital marketing services and you started freelancing for businesses so maybe share a bit of how you transition from there because it's actually something that I find very interesting um I have come across agency owners transit to okay I'll just become a e-commerce Merchant and I'll just do my thing I I stopped doing the servicing part you took the opposite route you know you were actually yeah and then uh you were actually a a e-commerce Merchant and then you decide to sell it and then you you know move into the agency so tell us a bit more about you know that transition and why do you make that transition uh right okay so um because uh okay the reason why I so was because Co there was Co and I I didn't want to deal with a lot of refunds and uh

Susan: returns so it was very it would be very Troublesome even I return also the um the Fulfillment agent it will be it will be very long so I don't to face all these consequences so I I so first so at that time other than uh my full-time job or or other parttime that I was doing I didn't have much uh much things to do all I did was like uh learn learn and new skills so uh so I one day I was actually this freelancing uh Journey started when I was when I moved out of my um my sister house and I was living alone and and I was very bored at the time so so uh I wanted to find something to to uh to work on so I I start I just posted uh this free service um like a translator or like just something G on on upw and F right right I did I just I was just testing out whether people really um you know hire me or not so yes so I got a few gigs and and I thought oh okay maybe I could I could try I could try to post more uh post more on like post more gigs or post more services on F upb so then uh luckily and or rather fortunately I I about a few local referrals and that's where I started uh being a freelancer then uh moving forward have Solutions right okay interesting so know coming from that angle right um You have been on both sides of it you have been a business owner and now you're an agency owner servicing business owners right um on their uh their market

Alva Chew: you know what kind of insights do you get from that you know how how does you know do you have a sense that that gives you a certain advantage or disadvantage when it comes to dealing with uh you know your customers right now okay uh uh of course event there are both pros and cons uh Pros is that I get

Susan: to share my experience okay I can tell them even from the marketing point of view I can tell them your pricing is very uh very off or or rather your product images are very very blur or even they very pated there a very very it's a very brief uh brief sample examples I can give so uh and then this Advantage is that um I wouldn't say there are disadvantages uh mainly I get to share my experience and and when I share my experience my clients like it mainly if they are e-commerce if they are service sorry if they are like restaurants like FMB and they might not be it might not be relatable to that okay okay got it so now when you share this kind of experience with business owners your clients right and and you know as you go along what are the most common mistakes that you see them like if you come to a point where you always have to say the same

Alva Chew: thing to them you know are are there very common mistakes or or you know common issues that almost the majority of your clients will always face you know when they come to talk to you and you talk to them it's always like these are always the things that you have to repeat are there such case

Susan: yes of course there there there cases because is a business owner I I can feel them like um because let's say they are running e-commerce products right they are really because most of them I really focus on the product uh so okay this is my product I want to sell but they don't look at things from uh the buyer point of view like buyer personal like that so that's why I I have to uh consult them in a way that okay if if the uh sometimes I also meet client who doesn't know how to price their product or like their even their services so that's why I like to consult them that okay you could put like U $49.50 $49 $39 something like that so uh it is so basically uh you don't make your product or service um look cheap but then uh but still it it it has some level of uh it make sure that the buyer has some level of confidence to purchase your product so for example you have to put in testimonials so uh yeah I have I I it's almost every and not every day it's almost every at every consultation is almost the same right okay and again I I as a fellow agency owner I probably

Alva Chew: share a similar thought I also feel that you know there were certain situations wherever we talk to customers and I mean you know not all the time they will listen to you right uh and and and probably you you experience that as well so in those situation what are the what do you see as the biggest obstacles for business owner why why are they not um taking your advice especially you know coming from you because you in in your case you have an advantage where you actually have run an e-commerce business and have sold it off right so you have that full experience and yet there will always be clients where they don't want to listen or they don't want to take the advice that you give now from your understanding typically what are some of what are the challenges that are facing there or what are OB preventing them from you know moving forward of taking action the way that you have suggested all right first thing um first thing is uh as uh because they are um okay as an e-commerce owner right uh I I also uh understand that they really like the product and though because they are

Susan: the owner so they started this so they they are very attached to what they believe in and so it is and then since they are the founder themselves it's hard to uh educate some some of the founders that are and then you know entrepreneurs Founders they can be very stubborn so so so so so sometimes uh I just um I try to share um proof like real life or rather real life example of proof that this is working uh but whether uh whether the client or the potential lead uh want to take action or not I don't force because I don't force sales or rather I I just want to make that they understand it at some point they will understand it if it's not working they will come back and ask me again so um even whether they ask me or not right they can even go and Google uh certain things that they want to know and I can still advise them so um I don't try to uh uh force them to believe in something that I'm saying but I try to show them proof that okay if you do this is my work or rather sometimes I like to show figers like data uh so maybe with the data or insights it's easier for them to believe yeah okay

Alva Chew: that's good and so on those uh cases where you know the the the clients the business owners believe in what you're sharing with them and they are ready to take action and of course probably engage your agency to help them with doing the necessary branding and and uh marketing campaigns right and as some of the and you looking at what you have done so far what has been the most successful Channel or tactics for acquiring and retaining customers especially from from the e-commerce landscape all right uh if we are talking about Shopify right there is a there

Susan: there are some uh Shopify apps that allow you to have um know a like iOS application in a phone you don't you don't need to have the you don't need go at theel the app but you can just uh convert your website into an application I think this is very useful and you can even send in app notifications to the to the buyers or whoever download the app so this is where I've seen damn a lot of um like really a lot of retainer sales uh so I think is the application is good uh because normally sometime people don't read emails so that's why uh with in app messages or in app uh notifications uh you can send you know you can you can give reminders to the buyers like whether there's promotions or anything so applications one thing that um one thing that e-commerce owners could look at and another way is uh of course collecting data collecting uh emails uh but even if you don't want to have an application for them to download you can still collect their email send them email marketing campaigns or and even you know do redating campaigns okay now on that right I have two points that I just want to dive deeper into you you it's interesting

Alva Chew: you mentioned about now maybe I'm old and and I'm old fashioned right but I was under the uh impression that at is actually a friction because you know these days getting people to download app is an extra ST right and we are now in stage of Technology where you don't really need to have uh a specific app per say right a lot of things can be done through what web app and things like that so but you mentioned that this has been something that's effective so you know from the data that you're you know what kind of download rate or what of percentage uh is that helpful and how do you also going back to my point is is there a challenge in getting customers to download or are tactics to reduce the friction and encourage customers to actually download the app all right very good question yeah so um how we how uh I I don't have a

Susan: percentage to to say that okay this is the number of Dos that I have uh I have uh had or rather how we can U make sure the users download and stay active okay first thing is that we we have to link it up with loyalty points uh so you have to have it like a bundle uh once you link up withy points if they download uh they get certain amount of points of course you give them big number of points for them to download because uh for future for future um purposes you can still you can send them notifications so once you have once you send them notifications right uh then they will they will actually go and look at it so you have to look you also have to look at um the promotion that you are running you have to compare like AB testing if I run this promotion how many people look at if I run another promotion buy one get one how many people view the apps so uh you have to look at the active users or which time of the day are they most active are they like office like corporate people or are they Freelancers and then I think based on the insights that you have that's why data collection is quite important and and to answer your question basically just link up with loyalty app and users users like people like free stuff so so and then maybe after they download and they they create account and then you give them another point on like just a freest sty for them to uh for them to redeem when they purchase something all right so so that means you also incorporate some form of gamification elements into the journey right to try and keep aning them to do more do more and then they get points and try to just like get them addicted to the whole process right okay that

Alva Chew: that's cool but okay then um on on that basis right now it is sounds great um but do use and when you share this cting with uh store Merchants right and I'm not sure if you um come across this a lot of e-commerce Merchants are very time on stream they are very time typ and they don't always have enough resources right so having another interface of having another uh channel to deal with sometimes can backfire because they don't have the time to deal with it right and I'm sure you know a lot of horror stories about you know still being good and then customer service goes all here while right so do you face such situations where you you advise them this and then uh either they okay yeah we would will download but they don't have they never do anything about it or they just have that resistance to to to to implement right um

Susan: yes I do face that so uh in in in such cases um I will when I when I pit them I would when I pit them I will tell them uh okay there will be two options I like to give uh clients options as well so option one we will set up everything for you and then um we will share with you how to do it and they do it yes but due to time constraint if you cannot do it um option two we will help you do it like monthly retainer fee off you know uh give us an access to the store then we will have you do it um but uh but uh of course um they once they start seeing some results uh they will be uh they will start focusing on you know uh putting more time and efforts into that application or rather the solution that we are proposing okay cool now um jumping to the other points that you mentioned just now where um you talk about you know even without that air

Alva Chew: collecting data like email right so I just want to get your opinion on right now looking at where we are heading uh in the market these days is eail still as effective or there is a preference of moving towards collecting phone numbers you know I've come across a quite a number of businesses over the last few wanting to collect phone numbers so that they can do you know WhatsApp messaging right so I'm sure you have come across that so based on what you're seeing um is email still more effective or you know phone numbers and where where are we going with

Susan: this um yes I I agree with you on that uh I will say I will go for phone numbers uh phone numbers are uh more active and you will receive more engagement compared to emails yes okay but but surprisingly right uh surprisingly I have seen uh those uh I because I also have a few uh like a few entrepreneurs that few entrepreneurs that I know on like Instagram they run marketing agencies as well and they are from uh like Europe or other countries so like Western countries so uh they are very very like really focusing on email marketing so they will do they will roll out these services like email email designs I think I think a lot of western western agencies are focusing on emails now yes which is why that was the part that I I thought it was a bit of uh interesting dichotomy I agree some of the you know uh agency owners that we were interacting with on Linkin in social media yes very focused on the email aspect the the Automation and the responders and in in Asia we are seeing a lot more on the phone number the the chat so that was interesting thing and I thought I wanted to get your take on it

Alva Chew: um because I also understand that you you probably also have some uh clients overseas in in other parts of the world not just uh in Asia itself so that you just want us to um have a you know understanding of your perspective from it and speaking of which right because now you you brought this thing up which is interesting so you sh clients in you know immediate southeast Asia and Asia region you also have some clients for away in other parts of the world are there any similarities or probably more interesting is are there any differences in the way they approach business in the way they you know uh respond with you as a service provider I would say um maybe because I haven't really met them in person but they are slightly harder to serve than Asian C I find that uh I've had this one client from Canada uh the want to run

Susan: ads um okay so I very similar to what we discussed just now it was very hard to convince uh this particular client that okay because you're new business your domain is new everything's new that your website is new uh so uh I mean since you you run an ATO company you also you'll be very familiar that uh since the the domain is new the domain authorities C is very less so you you can just go you can just uh you know expect all the traffic and this to come in from day one or day two or even day seven is is a long journey so um but then client was very um uh skeptical and and they were they were actually um uh quite indecisive of what they wanted to do but but of course their main goal was to get traffic within the within this area that they are they are serving in Canada so um I would say how they approach business um they are very uh they are very result oriented which is good um but they wouldn't want to know coordinate coordinate all this even sometime when we send approval send something for approval it takes quite a long longer than the normal period that we would uh advise them to review within within that certain period so I think it's is um I think uh more of a coordination um things okay I see um so you know in such situations how how do you try to resolve uh or you know you know uh overcome that situation um all right so it depends on the period of the time uh for example Peri of time as in when you run business not every month is a good month right y not good so okay let's say I'm very desperate for this client I'm very honest yeah I'm desperate for this client right so I have to I have to follow up with them and I have to uh be very professional and polite that uh um we have to work together very cly to make things work out uh but uh let's say I'm I'm very busy with other projects and okay this client is not responding not coordinating properly then I will openly tell them or rather give them a call that uh okay uh we have to work work very closely if not things will get out of hand and it will be hard to resolve later stage so I have to tell them that they either have to coordinate or it will be or we rather have to discuss what are the deliverables and what are the marketing activities
required for the brand or else they are just wasting money so I I definitely want clients to waste money on something they are not committed to right yes you're right and this especially true I mean a lot of times clients probably don't understand they always assume that

Alva Chew: oh agencies just burn money for them right I don't I think they don't probably understand that it's actually double stress for us because now we also have to worry about how to answer to them if if you know um certain tactics have gone wrong or or things like that right which speaking of now of all the Campa that you have done um you know for your clients like what are some of the memorable ones that you have done you know in terms of whether is it a very creative experience or you manage to get very uh uh good results or you know Roi or Ro from from the campaign what some of those more memorizes you can ship all um so one of the very memorable campaign was uh that time I was working with a creative agency uh I'm not friending the client so uh so um they will give us the creatives and we will work on the ads uh

Susan: Facebook ads Instagram ads so um at uh they did and then we also did like some customization for their shop five star I delivery tracking uh live chats Etc so uh we actually uh I was in I was I had access to Shopify to the Shopify and because we were running s we had to contact like Facebook pixels Google pixel uh so um I think the most memorable was um they had a 30% increase in Revenue over over one month of running Those ads and of course I have to admit that it was not only the efforts of our agency but also efforts from the creative itself it was they were running a festive campaign uh for Christmas so they were selling like um meat uh like you know to for Gatherings so yeah the creative was very good and um and we we did the the targeting very well and we did retargeting also and then they also saw an increase in like they are they are returning customer 2x I think two yeah 2x uh within that that month so uh yeah so it was one of the memorable campaigns that I've worked on so you were were talking about creative means that that was actually a Facebook campaign or was it uh um it was U it was Facebook and Instagram right right and on on on that right what do you think of um Tik Tok I mean obviously nowadays you know uh Tik Tok uh you know whatever is happening in Us St in us but you know at least in this part of the world Tik Tok is still you know kicking alive

Alva Chew:um so and I I think a lot of BRS are looking at Tik Tok uh but not exactly sure if you know most uh brands are getting the hang of it what's your experience so far with Tik Tok you know for both yourself as an agency and also you know some of you know the clients that you're are working

Susan: with uh as a as a user as a as a user I would say Tik Tok uh Tik to has a very good uh amount of um you know active users and plus uh the views are very good so um for e-commerce owners yes it's is it will be great if they can if they have enough time or like resources to work on Tik Tok videos they can just repost the r on Instagram to Tik Tok I mean it's it's it's time it saves the time a lot okay um and but then I haven't I haven't I only run a few ads for uh two brands for on Tik Tok so most of my clients they don't really focus on to work on Tik Tok videos they can just repost the r on Instagram to Tik Tok I mean it's it's it's time it saves the time a lot okay um and but then I haven't I haven't I only run a few ads for uh two brands for on Tik Tok so most of my clients they don't really focus on

Alva Chew: interesting um on that note there's also you know obviously the other big development in marketing space and and probably the whole world right of course it's AI right and there are so many aspects particularly when it comes to digital marketing there are so many aspects of digital marketing that now interesting um on that note there's also you know obviously the other big development in marketing space and and probably the whole world right of course it's AI right and there are so many aspects particularly when it comes to digital marketing there are so many aspects of digital marketing that now something of an empowerment for you to be able to grow your business further uh I think the Le one uh which is like it helps you grow for it have to grow faster or go far go further um with AI because uh it's it definitely saves your time when you're creating po or

Susan: when you're generating whether you're generating images but the only thing is uh I haven't really seen AI creating good um creatives you know like very good I think Photoshop and then figma people uh those Photoshop or rather graphic designers are still as they they still have their own jobs because they are creative and and Ai and unless you give a very good prompt AI might not be able to generate a very smooth image so for example some some letters might be off in the in the generated images uh but but still let's say you are generating for like uh let's say you are doing interior design um then then I think uh AI is able to generate a really good um outcome or rather whether it's image or copyrighting um yes so I think AI is something very helpful for even for brands or business owners so can in

Alva Chew: your current operation are you already incorporating AI into your workflow in in helping your customers or you know helping with any aspect of your business yes of course we use uh AI to generate some content uh and but not images as of now uh so maybe content and uh and I'm not so familiar with many

Susan: people at many agency or not or even on L is very um this thing of like automation is very high so so I I also sa some of the polls about automations but I never really go and look at it so okay okay I think is it's more of a sales Outreach so in my operational thing I'm uh Next Step I'm actually looking at is to automate like U Outreach Co Outreach with AI you know whether it's with Zia or any of the co Outreach software that that's actually that actually has ai ai in it to to personalize uh some of the messages right when you talk about Co when you talk about core outreach are you

Alva Chew: referring to um are you in the first place are you guys doing uh core Outreach at this moment is it something is it a routine thing that you guys are doing not yet that's why I exp okay right right right okay which is interesting because uh I was speaking to another agency owner uh in a previous episode and apparently he didn't he didn't do much out a lot of it was Inbal which which kind of also is a testament to the quality of his content because his clients are coming in because they were attracted by his content right um so now on on on the when you talk about the outbound and having that uh AI work flow right and you're mentioning that you also have ai in in some of your processes there is also a concern you know in in in the space there's also concern and also clients have some concerns whereby okay how much of your content how much of creation is AI and how much is human right do you face such concerns or questions from your customers do they question you about it or do they insist that oh no no Susan everything must be human I I cannot deal with it do have you come across such things um I haven't really come across

Susan: such client yet uh but uh so far uh from all the uh contents that we have delivered um so why there was no complaint yet maybe I haven't met that certain client uh and also main because I'm now uh focusing really on projects of like development like it and software development rather than uh just you know doing some content because very honestly it takes it really takes a lot of efforts on the back end that that clients or users might not see so um uh so and then um I'm I'm very passionate in Tech and technical things is not very something that we have solution might be might be pursuing in in future uh rather content kind of thing so but but so far maybe because the clients are uh doing a retainer or my long-term clients so they do understand that and even if we generate AI the ideas that come from us we let's say we want to want okay we want this sentence to par this particular this sentence to be very fun uh very fun then we will ask a to generate something fun to replace this sentence and then we see if it's uh if if it's relatable to the brand then we put in if it's not we have to rephrase ourself no I I I was just wondering you know if there would be clients that actually tell you you know Susan just just just use AI just you know add again which which brings to another point you know there's always good and bad there was always two sides to the same ch

Alva Chew: right they come across clients where they say oh no you know these kind of things are so easy you can use AI to do it and and they use it as an excuse to actually kind of like maybe bargain with you to to lower the prices and you come across think like that and how do you counter that uh I haven't come across that but yesterday yes I did come I did I did uh call a potenti lead Le so there was they sent they send in the inquiry that they were interested in um in uh website development it's a new website so okay I was like okay this might be

Susan: potential because they called in so I call back and and um and they say they already uh pay deposit to another freelancer uh and and uh and what they say is that um because this freelancer charged them uh slightly not slightly it's very low amount to to do SEO plus web design development plus content writing for them content is a website content so this is an interior design firm so what they what the guy we talk about 10 minutes you to this Le that I'm not going to get so so and he he particularly told me that um he asked the freelancer to generate everything using AI because he say he need him to use AI uh okay okay okay I mean that's a that's a very very specific demand okay yeah yeah right right so so I mean um but so so you saying that yeah he actually used that example to tell you that oh you know you should charge this much because that's the amount that he was paying they so this kind of client point of view is that or rather they are thinking is that I I'm just risking I'm just risking $500 for this even if nothing no result or if I even if I don't get anything I'm I just lose $500 it's fine but of course from from yourself or from my point of view is is you know um you are rather you rather pay a little more for a better service or more of a uh more of an experience uh deliverables that you are going to get yeah so I think just it's just a difference in what the client is going to risk and what the what his expectations are

Alva Chew: yeah I mean if you're just willing to pay I mean I would have said that you know that's why you end up having the freelancer disappearing because you only pay that amount you I mean that that's kind of obvious isn't it but you bring up something that is kind of interesting which again you know it's something that touches uh my passion as well and I think we we shared about this previously you you just now talk about oh you know Hub Solutions moving for might not be in marketing right you guys are moving more into it and software which is actually the trajectory that I'm on you know obviously shifting from uh the SEO the digital marketing to to software now aroch chat with AI chatbot so tell me more about you know that portion you know are you also going into the AI space or just software in general and have what where's that direction you're hting um or rather more more specifically right micro it are you looking at a um more like Software House kind of uh direction or perhaps also developing some of your own product sort of situation uh okay uh more of a for now it will be more of a software house uh even if I do some kind of startup in

Susan: might be just personal ones not really get to H Solutions but have soltions more of it is more of like uh software house as in even under Software House I like to differentiate myself as uh Shopify experts or U yeah because uh I still have very uh very huge passion in Shopify store like building either building myself or building for clients and I I feel that um you know it's very funny I've seen a few clients they are using uh you know they are paying two subscription but they are using Squarespace plus they using Shopify and so this Squarespace website Weir to Shopify for e-commerce I was like what why are you paying two subscription you can Even build things on big pages on Shopify you can you can cancel square space right uh but but I I I have not gotten the project yet so I cannot really go and tell them you have to cancel this or that so I think yeah that's where I like to see which um I to make I like to save money for clients and I think it's a it's a something that I'm I'm proud of doing and I like to listen to client requirements and marketing you you tend to uh talk a lot to explain to the client but technical things you get client requirement and you you list out what the proposal or what's the architecture of the you know of the system will be or the software be then you can even rather like server size or um so I think it's I'm very um focus on this direction of you know Shopify yeah no you know on that on that Prospect of your you're talking about right I think if you don't mind I can just give you a little tip right and maybe that might help you tip over and win them over you can tell them that you know if you're if you're doing a Weg site and

Alva Chew: then you redirect to Shopify right uh that's not good for SEO oh okay yeah it's it basically means you're trying to build two castles with one resource it's going to spread thin and then because again you know if you're talking about Su you wanted to buildt on the main domain right so if you if you have two websites one on and and they on different platforms so you have one on weeks and you have one on Shopify essentially means one is a main domain and one is a subdomain that wouldn't work because then Google or search engine just consider them as two separate sites so yeah so so the the the best argument for not doing that right is it actually doesn't do well for SEO it you either stick with I mean again wigs of course have e-commerce right weeks e-commerce so you if you know you want you either throw everything to Wix or you throw everything to Shopify yeah but don't do the whole you know one on the other it it it really doesn't work that well yeah thanks for the tip appreciate tell them tomorrow yeah so yeah and um on on that right now moving forward um well I mean of course you are you're moving uh you're still you're thinking of moving into the software it right but right now you're still look uh working with clients on their marketing are there some Trends moving forward now in 2025 and moving forward where you look at the e-commerce Trends or marketing trends that you feel particularly excited about uh there things that you know that feels that oh you know the these are some of cool things that you probably want to try out or either for your own business or for the clients that you're servicing yeah uh first thing is I think viral hooks uh viral hooks are very uh

Susan: particularly excited about uh there things that you know that feels that oh you know the these are some of cool things that you probably want to try out or either for your own business or for the clients that you're servicing yeah uh first thing is I think viral hooks uh viral hooks are very uh

Alva Chew: guy would just blew up on Tik Tok and I I saw someone posting about him on Linkin today was that Tony guy from Tony yeah he was doing the the the fin AG right everybody's talking about it I mean my my my co- production crew was talking about it for the last two weeks it was if if Tony see this podcast we I probably I probably should get Tony on to this and and you know get to share about how how he came up with this yeah quite good and another thing is I think influencer marketing still work very well it doesn't it can be micro

Susan: influencers like just you just um uh you know have lots of uh creators not influencer but creators you have a lot of uh know uh like a bundle of all the videos then you you publish all the ads that's the work for e-commerce Brands yeah and the last one the last one is um if you if you like if you corporate or rather a service provider and you have a whole team right and you have an office or rather whether you have an office or not if you have a whole team and then I think um like employee or rather like team member engagement is very important as well so so like team member um interact uh inter team member creating real I I yesterday I saw one on Instagram that the the the founder praise their team members for creating uh for for um for agreeing to appear in the RS and then you know like some CA they like to shoot their stuff and and I
think is a very good U interaction between between the brand and the the team members themselves yeah I I think you you spoke to if nominal if I can you know uh categorize it correctly whereby I think you know just you talk about the viral books you know is it's appealing to and

Alva Chew: everybody know who we are talking about right and and that that whole team member interaction thing I think it speaks to this idea of these days uh the audience they really prefer something that is more authentic that is more true you know it's not just you know very polish selling right they want to see what's behind the scene they want to see real human Direction and I I think that's that you know the the the the trends that you just mentioned are kind of reflective of what the audience are are looking for moving forward yeah so a um those are very great insights and a lot of good sharing that you have given us in this session so before we wrap up are there any um words of wisdom or any takeaways you want to give to agency owners or business owners who are you know starting their e-commerce or already in the process of growing

Susan: their uh I think uh I I always stick to this this um quote uh that like tough times don't last but tough people do so I think yeah I think even if you uh if you face a lot of my obstacles right just don't give up I mean um it's it's a it's just a matter of time you get things right right right again going back to that resilience and persistent you know in in in character yes I think you yeah absolutely right very true and you what about you what what kind of quote or what kind of like sayings do you stick to um I think for now and in fact I think I I wrote

Alva Chew: something on LinkedIn about it uh I think it boys down to self-identification right um You can be motivated by things and you can have the discipline to do things you always would find it a struggle to do things to achieve what you want if it's driven by some form of external motivation or you have to inject discipline to do it right you always feel diet you always struggle and you always question like oh why should I do it you know why am I suffering this right you you still to question and you still get you start get dejected and some point you probably will just skip up I think from my experience what I see is boys down to self identification which means if you look at yourself in the mirror and you look at the person that's looking back at you from opposite side of the mirror do you like what you see do you like what you are is this what you are meant to be and I think that understanding of your self identity is very important because once you identified with a version of you that you are totally in alignment with and agree with right I think something magical happens where your entire mental state your entire physical state your
entire psychological State moves with it and because of that the entire Universe moves with you and I think that's something that I I I I strongly believe in uh these days right that's very interesting yeah I saw the post by the way yes yeah so um thank you for for taking time to join us in this session yeah thank you ala and the team all right thanks

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